A few years ago I asked Vasiliy Polovnikov to help me with my lifting. “Well, to start, your shoulders are too small. You need to press,” he said to me. I told him that I do press, quite frequently. “Clearly, it’s not working. You’re either not actually doing presses, or you’re doing them wrong.”
At the time I was on a program that had me doing presses at least once a week for 4 or 5 sets of 5. So naturally, I thought that Vasiliy was just being an asshole.
Here is where we had the disconnect. The press I was doing was technically a press – but I wasn’t using the pressing technique that builds the muscles needed in the jerk.
With most strength exercises like the squat, pull or press, there are generally 2 different ways of doing them:
1.) The most efficient way, with which we can lift the most.
2.) The less efficient way, but one that develops the specific muscles needed for weightlifting.
Both approaches are useful. Knowing the difference in these techniques allows us to apply exercises and their variations more precisely. I was using the technique with which I could press most efficiently. It wasn’t giving me the specific strength I needed. This was why my shoulders weren’t developed, as Vasiliy pointed out.
The Efficient and Stronger Press
The (clean and) press was a part of weightlifting competitions until 1972. The goal was to press as much as possible, and weightlifters had an effective technique that allowed them to do so. The back bent backwards and the lifter pushed the bar away from the chest/shoulders. Lifters were able to press very effectively using the larger muscle groups. The press I was doing before working with Vasiliy was a less extreme version of this:
By doing this efficient press, or a version of it – we can become great pressers. But the goal of weightlifters is no longer to become the best at pressing. By doing this type of press, we’re putting ourselves in positions that we wouldn’t want to be in during the jerk:
When the weights get heavy and we’re tired, our bodies automatically resort to the efficient and stronger pressing technique. If we press this way, or a less extreme version of it, we develop habits of leaning back during the jerk, or pressing the bar forward – both of which would make the catch of the jerk very difficult.
We’ve seen some of the best weightlifters demonstrate their very heavy presses on Youtube. Understandably, when the goal is to demonstrate pressing strength, they do so in a way that allows them to press the most. However, when they’re training, they press in another way and with another purpose – to increase their competition lifts.
Pressing competition between the Olympic Champion Dmitriy Berestov and Chingiz Mogushkov
Strict Press for Modern Weightlifting
Weightlifters should press with the same trajectory as the jerk in order to build the concrete strength needed in the jerk.
- Starting position:
- Full grip on the bar
- Bar resting on the deltoids
- Vertical Torso
- Elbows pointing about 45° down
- Weight balanced on the front part of the heel (between mid-foot and heel).
- The bar should be pushed up and must remain above the deltoids.
- Torso may not lean back and must remain vertical.
- If the chin or the nose get in the way of the bars path – move balance further back on the heels.
- As the bar passes the forehead, the bar should be pushed slightly back, and the head slightly forward.
- In the final position:
- The bar should be slightly behind the head
- Elbows should be locked and pointed slightly back (not extreme)
- Shoulders blades should be locked together
- Shoulders should be raised 50%. The traps and upper back muscles should be engaged. (More on this final position in a future post.)
Me, pressing.
Strict presses are typically done one to two time per week, for 4-5 sets of 3 to 6 reps. The weight used shouldn’t force the athlete to ever fall out of jerk positions. At the same time, the athlete should push him or herself to try to increase the reps or weight used every week during the volume phase. Sitting while pressing is a good alternative to the standing press, as it adds variety and forces a more strict press.
Everyone is built different. For those who have naturally strong shoulders, or don’t have any weaknesses in the jerk, presses may not be needed at all. My shoulders weren’t developed the way they should be for jerking. Since then, I’ve invested my energy into a jerk-like press – and added additional bodybuilding exercises. My shoulders grew and my jerk increased.
Yasha! What about the “klokov” press, or snatch grip press behind the neck? I use this press predominantly due to a low ceiling height in my basement “gym”.
As weightlifters we should do presses of all kinds. Doing snatch grip presses are good (and necessary for most lifters), but won’t help too much with the jerk. Doing seated strict presses (standard or behind head) are a good alternative to standing presses – especially if you have a low ceiling.
Great blog man, keep it up!
Good post. I’m personally guilty of doing a press for weight rather than form. An additional benefit I find is that my rack position becomes more stable, as bigger delts give you a bigger ‘groove’ to rest the bar in.
Hello Yasha,
I’ve seen Ilya doing a lot of push presses and rarely,if ever presing.At the time he toured the usa with you,did he ever mentioned anything about it? It seems it doesn’t affect much his jerk 🙂
I don’t think i’ve seen Ilya do the press, or discussed it with him. Some lifters don’t press at all, others do a lot. It could also be that he wasn’t doing presses at the time, the conversation about presses didn’t come up, and youtube doesn’t capture the lower weight support exercises as much. I haven’t seen Ilya bench press (in person or on youtube) but when the conversation came up he talked about his bench press goals – what he wanted to bench press when he was moving up to the 105s.
I can’t believe that Alekseyev Press was passed by the refs!! MUCH too quick!!! I realize this “controversy” was a reason the Clean & Press was dropped from competition (the other being excessive backbend, making it more of a Bench Press) but really! Was the Jury sound asleep at that meet?!? Doug Hepburn of Canada was one of the greatest pressers of all time. His secret? “Handstand presses”!! It still blows my mind to picture this massive guy upside down, pressing his bodyweight up to locked arms.
I like the blog. Great detailed posts.
I’ve been focusing more on presses lately and I find pressing with the bar behind the neck helps me to keep strict form. Additionally it’s built my rear trap region quite a bit and has helped with keeping the bar fixed overhead in the snatch.
Great blog Yasha, thanks for sharing!!
Great post. I’m really enjoying the blog.
I’ve been doing the press “for weight”, and my shoulders are still lacking it. I’ll try this strict press next time.
Also, could you specify what additional bodybuilding exercises works good for shoulders?
Presses from behind with a clean or snatch grip are both good. Building up the bench press, pull ups, bent over rows, and lateral raises will all be good, so long as you continually work on flexibility.
I know this article is quite old but i still wanted to ask some questions since this is really interesting.
Back before 1972 we had two types of pressers. Speed pressers like S.Reding and V.Alexeev and Strength pressers like T.Kono and H.Bettemborg.
The speed presses like Alexeev broke many C&J records, the strength pressers few or none.
The speed pressers more or less did a hip thrusted jerk, while the strength presses used more or less only upper body strength.
My question based on your article is; when you say weak shoulders, do you mean that the press should be done like the strength pressers did(minus the layback) even if the old data says, that those who did that kind of press had an low C&J transer.
Some old CCCP data after 1972 also stated that the push press(that has the same trajectory as the strict press) had low or little transfer to the jerk.
My five cent would be that the old style ol-press/speed press would have great transfer to the C&J however its so hard to learn that one would probably get killed while trying to learn it.
I also see some Russians like Berestov that use the RAF-press(hip thrust after the bar has passed the sticking point, dont active not just as an layback). How common is that kind of press. And do you believe that the press with any kind of hip movement is beneficial for the jerk.
Thank you for excellent articels
Vsego Horoshego!
Have you been to Rhode Island barbell?
No, I haven’t
How do you find your correct grip width for jerks/presses? I have been looking for it for a long time. When I grip wider, I feel it improves my flexibility but my strength goes down. When I grip closer, my strength is better but my overhead flexibility feel very restricted. I don’t know what to do.
The narrower the better, as you can feel when the hands are narrower you’re stronger there. If you don’t have the flexibility with that narrow grip in the overhead position, I suggest using these stretches for a week: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tlOeir5PCc&feature=youtu.be
Once flexible in the overhead position with a narrow grip, you still need to build strength there for it to be an effective position. If it never becomes a good position (narrow grip, overhead) then work on strengthening the wider grip overhead position by doing all presses (push, strict, sitting, behind the head, bench) with that grip until it’s strong.
Hey, don’t know if you still maintain this blog but I wonder about the use of the behind the neck strict press over the “jerk style” strict press. I feel like the press behind neck requires a greater emphasis on using the traps to lift the weight and hence use it moreso than press from the front rack.
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